The Structure of the legislative branch

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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  River on Mon Feb 21, 2011 7:27 pm

Indeed. Runoff's would most likely be a remote possibility, imho.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Jerksborough on Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:14 pm

Serenel wrote:well you see that could be a problem, especially if three people run for Prime Minister or whatever.

because we would want, i hope a system where the Prime Minister needs to get 50%+1 to get elected, therefore we may need to concieve of a way to have run off elections.

50% +1 is a good idea. What special powers (if any) does the Prime Minister have that members of the General Assembly don't?

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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Serenel on Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:16 pm

Well that still has to be defined.

and before we can define that, we have two other things we need to decide upon.

one we are currently voting on, if we want a Prime Minister or Presient instead of the three headed monster.

and then we have to decide if we want a Prime Minister or President.

i will lay out the differences once the referendum is complete, or it has such a large victory margin its defeat would be considered improbable.

and we are about one vote away from that in my opinion.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  River on Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:17 pm

He gets to chose his cabinet and is the head of the government.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Cool Egg Sandwich on Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:26 pm

River wrote:He gets to chose his cabinet and is the head of the government.

Yeah, something that mimics the roles / capacities of an American President. That's something I think most people will be most familiar and comfortable with.

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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Jerksborough on Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:26 pm

Can I change my vote in the poll? I originally voted for the triumvirate, but have been swayed to the single house model.

Is it necessary to have a prime minister/president with a cabinet? These positions are artifacts of representative democracies. If our system is based on suffrage of all members, does the office of prime minister really hold any value?

Perhaps we should elect a house speaker every two weeks or something, and say that the speaker is the only person who can recognize new legislation. Any member who wants to submit new legislation must gain the approval of the speaker, and the speaker will create and mediate any polls that must be held before the legislation can be passed or failed. Thoughts?

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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Jerksborough on Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:29 pm

Cool Egg Sandwich wrote:
River wrote:He gets to chose his cabinet and is the head of the government.

Yeah, something that mimics the roles / capacities of an American President. That's something I think most people will be most familiar and comfortable with.

The American President is one of three levels of government that must all work together in order to get things done. It's an overly complex system to impose on the single house idea that we're working on here.

The Canadian system of Prime Minister is really closer to what we need, but is still the result of there being parties who generally band together in votes. We don't really have that either, so maybe its not necessary.

I guess what I'm advocating here is to strip off all of the fat and complexity. If we make the system easy to grasp, we'll get more participation and our discussions can centre around the legislation that we propose instead of around the methods by which that legislation must be passed.

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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Serenel on Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:30 pm

You need an executive to be able to get things done in a timely mannor, and to direct the actions of the government, be the face of the region abroad, and to take action swifley.

and you are speaking of two different issues i beleive, i may be confused though.

but from reading your post you want to change your vote from the Trimuritive, to a General Assembly...but those are two sepereate topics/debates/issues.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  River on Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:46 pm

In the future, political parties may emerge here. I may even want to bring my old party back to life.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Anglenburgh on Mon Feb 21, 2011 11:52 pm

I love the idea of political parties, I have other nations in a few other regions and I take on a completely different persona in every one Smile
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Serenel on Tue Feb 22, 2011 1:58 am

Political Parties can be really good for activity, but they can also lead to devisivness, which can be really bad for activity.

its a double-edge sword, and i think it should be left up to the General Assembly to decide how to handle the question of allowing 'Formal' political partys, seeing as how the Assembly can not control the formation of 'Informal' political partys/factions, as they seem to occur naturally as time passes.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  River on Tue Feb 22, 2011 8:04 am

The generally accepted practice for establishing political parties are for three citizens to petition the powers that be to be allowed to form their party. If a party falls below the magic number of three active members, the party is dissolved.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Cool Egg Sandwich on Tue Feb 22, 2011 2:25 pm

River wrote:The generally accepted practice for establishing political parties are for three citizens to petition the powers that be to be allowed to form their party. If a party falls below the magic number of three active members, the party is dissolved.

Sounds good.

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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Anglenburgh on Tue Feb 22, 2011 7:30 pm

Cool Egg Sandwich wrote:
River wrote:The generally accepted practice for establishing political parties are for three citizens to petition the powers that be to be allowed to form their party. If a party falls below the magic number of three active members, the party is dissolved.

Sounds good.

Agreed.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Serenel on Tue Feb 22, 2011 7:43 pm

I too agree that is how it is usually done.

however it is still a matter for the General Assembly beieve and still would need to be codified into law.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Cool Egg Sandwich on Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:34 pm

Serenel wrote:I too agree that is how it is usually done.

however it is still a matter for the General Assembly beieve and still would need to be codified into law.

This.

I don't think many will disagree with the formation of parties, though. It will, at least , promote activity.

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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  River on Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:39 pm

Q: Does any IRL government codify Political Parties into law?

The Legislature can set requirements for their existence, but there is nothing prohibiting members forming their own PAC's or Parties without the governments permission.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Serenel on Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:42 pm

Well, in the game this forum is adminitered by administrators, and there is nothing compelling an administrator to do anything to give a set group of people their own private area to discuss things.

if there was a law though administration would be compelled to abide.

also there is nothing that would bring re-course to an administrator if he gave one group their own private settings and another group nothing.

and in RL political parties are legislated in a way, why do you think in the US there is no strong third party.

it is because election law is made by the states, and the state legislatures are overlaiden with Dems and Reps, who make it almost impossible for third party candidates to make it on the ballot.


Last edited by Serenel on Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:53 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Cool Egg Sandwich on Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:44 pm

I think we definitely want political parties.

We do not want the growth of those political parties only to rival each other.

I am not against political parties, but I will certainly be very careful before joining one, I can tell you that much.

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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  River on Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:11 pm

Serenel wrote:Well, in the game this forum is adminitered by administrators, and there is nothing compelling an administrator to do anything to give a set group of people their own private area to discuss things.

if there was a law though administration would be compelled to abide.

also there is nothing that would bring re-course to an administrator if he gave one group their own private settings and another group nothing.

and in RL political parties are legislated in a way, why do you think in the US there is no strong third party.

it is because election law is made by the states, and the state legislatures are overlaiden with Dems and Reps, who make it almost impossible for third party candidates to make it on the ballot.

In many regions that I have belonged to, Political Parties had off-site forums so that the Admin's did go peeking. Which will happen here.

The reason for no third party in the US is that the blatant stupidity of the masses. "My family has ALWAYS voted *** and that's how I vote". If Pol Pot was the candidate for their party, they'd vote for him.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Cool Egg Sandwich on Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:17 pm

I heard Pol Pot didn't actually commit human rights abuses.

Little birdy told me that Cambodia is a myth.

In all seriousness though, you are right River. Political ignorance is far worse than political apathy.

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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  River on Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:22 pm

Cambodia? Never heard of it.

When you live in a major metropolitan area as I do, you're confronted with this attitude and mentality on a daily basis. It make me want to kill someone.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Serenel on Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:33 pm

There is really no reason to have an offsite fourm.

of course they could do so, but it would be an example of an 'informal' political party, and no one recgonized by the laws of the Dirty South.

and while your 'reason for their being no strong third party' while you are correct that some people do vote with their family, that is not the reason why there is no third party.

the formal party organization has to go through alot of stuff in order to even be on the ballot, and then they have to use even more time and money campagining/growing name recgonition.

also more and more people are breaking with their 'families' ideas.

i know kids who have liberal families and they are conservative, and like for me, i have a conservative family, and i am fairly liberl...
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Anglenburgh on Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:37 pm

The thing that worries me is this: What if, once political parties are established, that's all nations vote for, what their party leaders say to? That is something that always bothers me because I have seen it happen before, both in RL and on NS.
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Re: The Structure of the legislative branch

Post  Cool Egg Sandwich on Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:40 pm

Anglenburgh wrote:The thing that worries me is this: What if, once political parties are established, that's all nations vote for, what their party leaders say to? That is something that always bothers me because I have seen it happen before, both in RL and on NS.

Well you can't legislate against how people want to vote. You can only campaign, engage in informed debate, and hope that people make a decision for themselves. All we can do is give people the opportunity, inform them, and encourage them to participate.

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